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I Feel Sorry For Monsters.

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12 minutes ago, Jjang said:

Then what are you saying? 8 years ago Madonna was still in her 50's, why didn't ageism affect her then too?

You know damn very well the answer and how music industry changed since 2008. And yes she was affected. You can use 4Minutes all you want (that was only played because of Justin), but what happened to Give it 2 me? Miles away? Celebration? Sorry? Get together? Jump?

They only charted better because charts were different and she was able to debut high with big fanbase buying physical copies and because she was big during MTV era.

 

 


 

 

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2 minutes ago, Li'l Sebastian said:

If that was debut album by random pop girl would you be saying 'oh it's shit because i know that she can do better and released better' lmfao1

No but I would also think it's basic and horribly produced, which I already stated in one of the very first posts of our unfortunate conversation anna1 You can believe that or not, but I know that for me that is the truth because I have slammed plenty of pop debut albums for being uninventive and boring. Trust me, RH would not impress me. I even told you that I'm pretty confident I can only enjoy some of the songs on that album because I can hear Madonna on them ayumi1 I only need to imagine Ariana releasing Unapologetic Bitch for a few seconds and I'm already embarrassed I'm even playing it in my head chi1 So I'm both judging RH for being mediocre on its own ànd for being mediocre when compared to Madonna's catalogue and I already told you I'm doing both way earlier so omg why isn't this convo developing.

5 minutes ago, Li'l Sebastian said:

Because unlike Art pop, RH is NOT outdated overproduced EDM mess and you can actually hear that with your ears lmfao1

Omg who's trying to shove opinions down people's throats now huh. Sorry, I just genuinely don't hear anything NOT outdated on RH. I can agree about the overproduced stuff, but that doesn't mean I'll suddenly enjoy the album more or whatever. Nor do I think MDNA was overproduced.

You can judge me for saying that but then you are obviously not someone to spend much time on a forum where you're bound to encounter different opinions and experiences of quality feb1

8 minutes ago, Li'l Sebastian said:

I never claimed that RH is masterpiece, it's not in my top 5 albums but i'm also not hating it because it's not on par with my favorite albums. Something you obviously have problem with.

I still don't get why that's such a bad thing. Am I supposed to think the worst Michael record is good because I don't know he made Off the Wall? Wouldn't any Michael fan be like: "well, that really is one of his worst records, you should try Off the Wall or Thriller" julia1 Why can't I dislike RH because I know Madge can do better? Why can't I use that dislike to prove that not all Madonna fans are easily swayed by this "well your own fav sucks rn" bs? Why do you have such a problem with me hating that album because it's not on par with my favorite albums? mad2 Maybe try to explain that. I don't like that album because it genuinely sucks, just like ARTPOP, imo AND I think she can do better. There you have it. Is that so fucking problematic?

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15 minutes ago, Jjang said:

Then what are you saying? 8 years ago Madonna was still in her 50's, why didn't ageism affect her then too?

Beyonce has 20 Grammys awards, why didn't racism affect her?

 

Jimi Hendrix 0 Grammys

Pattie Labelle 2 Grammys

Tupac Shakur 0 Grammys

Nas 0 Grammys

Nicki Minaj 0 Grammys

Diana Ross 0 Grammys

Etta James 3 Grammys

Jazmine Sullivan 0 Grammys

Notorious B.I.G 0 Grammys

Snoop Dogg  0 Grammys

Aaliyah 0 Grammys

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13 minutes ago, Li'l Sebastian said:

You know damn very well the answer and how music industry changed since 2008. And yes she was affected. You can use 4Minutes all you want (that was only played because of Justin), but what happened to Give it 2 me? Miles away? Celebration? Sorry? Get together? Jump?

They only charted better because charts were different and she was able to debut high with big fanbase buying physical copies and because she was big during MTV era.

Sorry spent 7 weeks #1 worldwide. 

Give it 2 Me spent 11 weeks in the top 10 worldwide.

Hung Up... do you really want me to bring that up again? chi1

Living For Love didn't spend a week in the top 40 worlwide. Oh, is it just because one UK radio station blocked her ass?chi1

 

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2 minutes ago, Earth Ripper said:

No but I would also think it's basic and horribly produced, which I already stated in one of the very first posts of our unfortunate conversation anna1 You can believe that or not, but I know that for me that is the truth because I have slammed plenty of pop debut albums for being uninventive and boring. Trust me, RH would not impress me. I even told you that I'm pretty confident I can only enjoy some of the songs on that album because I can hear Madonna on them ayumi1 I only need to imagine Ariana releasing Unapologetic Bitch for a few seconds and I'm already embarrassed I'm even playing it in my head chi1 So I'm both judging RH for being mediocre on its own ànd for being mediocre when compared to Madonna's catalogue and I already told you I'm doing both way earlier so omg why isn't this convo developing.

Omg who's trying to shove opinions down people's throats now huh. Sorry, I just genuinely don't hear anything NOT outdated on RH. I can agree about the overproduced stuff, but that doesn't mean I'll suddenly enjoy the album more or whatever. Nor do I think MDNA was overproduced.

You can judge me for saying that but then you are obviously not someone to spend much time on a forum where you're bound to encounter different opinions and experiences of quality feb1

I still don't get why that's such a bad thing. Am I supposed to think the worst Michael record is good because I don't know he made Off the Wall? Wouldn't any Michael fan be like: "well, that really is one of his worst records, you should try Off the Wall or Thriller" julia1 Why can't I dislike RH because I know Madge can do better? Why can't I use that dislike to prove that not all Madonna fans are easily swayed by this "well your own fav sucks rn" bs? Why do you have such a problem with me hating that album because it's not on par with my favorite albums? mad2 Maybe try to explain that. I don't like that album because it genuinely sucks, just like ARTPOP, imo AND I think she can do better. There you have it. Is that so fucking problematic?

And once again you wrote that that you are simply not capable of listening it and judging it without going back to her catalog. You probably decided to hate it and never wanted to change your opinion.

 

And no you wouldn't be saying that shit if someone else released it as debut album because you would've have known shit about that artists and what that artist is capable of.

 

Ariana and Madonna have nothing in common so you once again did same thing you were ding yesterday, running to something/someone that has nothing to do with Madonna and her own music just to point out how bad it is.

 

 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Li'l Sebastian said:

And once again you wrote that that you are simply not capable of listening it and judging it without going back to her catalog. You probably decided to hate it and never wanted to change your opinion.

What?! cry3

Of course I can't listen to it without thinking of her earlier catalogue, you're not able to do that physically if you actually listened to her earlier work. But I did say (multiple times now) that I believe that if I had that ability, I still wouldn't be impressed..

I literally just wrote this:

"So I'm both judging RH for being mediocre on its own ànd for being mediocre when compared to Madonna's catalogue and I already told you I'm doing both way earlier so omg why isn't this convo developing"

Cackle.

5 minutes ago, Li'l Sebastian said:

And no you wouldn't be saying that shit if someone else released it as debut album because you would've have known shit about that artists and what that artist is capable of.

Then why didn't I like 1000 Forms of Fear without knowing Sia's earlier music? Then why didn't I like 21 without knowing Adele's earlier record? Then why didn't I like Rihanna's debut only knowing her first single? dead4 Because I thought the music was basic and people were overrating it. So that would be an exact parallel with what I think would happen if I heard RH as a debut album (and omg if you seriously believe that anyone would've been interested in that album as a debut, I seriously think you're mental) julia1

7 minutes ago, Li'l Sebastian said:

Ariana and Madonna have nothing in common so you once again did same thing you were ding yesterday, running to something/someone that has nothing to do with Madonna and her own music just to point out how bad it is.

But you're the one who keeps telling me that I wouldn't be saying shit if someone else released RH as a debut album bey5 Then who the fuck am I supposed to imagine releasing it? You're the one insisting that I shouldn't judge the album based on Madonna's track record, then how the fuck am I supposed to judge the album?

I chose Ariana to compare Unapologetic Bitch to because it actually has some minor musical resemblances to Side to Side chi1 To me it's obvious that if I imagine Ariana recording both tracks, Side to Side would instantly shine as the superior track. How else am I supposed to balance out my supposedly biased take on RH as a Madonna album? You're making no sense.

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Just now, Jjang said:

Sorry spent 7 weeks #1 worldwide. 

Give it 2 Me spent 11 weeks in the top worldwide.

Hung Up... do you really want me to bring that up again? chi1

Living For Love didn't spend a week in the top 40 worlwide. Oh, is it just because one UK radio station blocked her ass?chi1

 

What chart worldwide? MEDIATRAFFIC? you do realize that singles chart is pointless there since it's not about sales? lmfao1 

Living for love just like the rest of those songs debuted high on DIGITAL sales charts, and charts today are not about SALES like they were 10 years ago when she debuted high and fell like a rock.

 

So if she is only banned on one radio station in UK show me receipts of her not being banned in the rest of the world? Why wasn't she able to enter top 70 on airplay chart if it was only one radio station? Why wasn't she able to enter top 100 radio chart in US? Top 50 on POP? Isn't she queen of pop?

I mean if there is no such thing as radio ban these days for older acts why wasn't she played like she was 10 years ago when music industry was different. I mean according to you people don't have problem with her age and her music is acclaimed by critics just like it was 10 years ago.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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21 minutes ago, H.O.N.E.Y said:

Beyonce has 20 Grammys awards, why didn't racism affect her?

 

Jimi Hendrix 0 Grammys

Pattie Labelle 2 Grammys

Tupac Shakur 0 Grammys

Nas 0 Grammys

Nicki Minaj 0 Grammys

Diana Ross 0 Grammys

Etta James 3 Grammys

Jazmine Sullivan 0 Grammys

Notorious B.I.G 0 Grammys

Snoop Dogg  0 Grammys

Aaliyah 0 Grammys

But that's not the same case omg do you legit think I can be tricked that easily? eve1

You can assume that these artists never won a Grammy due to racism on Grammy's side, sure, although I personally think Grammys awards are meaningless and the Academy has no taste to begin with - does this pattern apply to Madonna's case? nope. ew1 This is how Madonna's case applies on the scenario you created :

(1) 'X' black artist has been sweeping Grammys left and right ever since the beginning of his/her career.

(2) 'X' black artist suddenly stopped winning the last few years.

(3) 'X' black artist's fans claim it's because of racism. 

Now, does that sound like a convincing argument or rather lazy one to you? be honest. demi1

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My fav Madonna album no joke chi1


Opinion invalidated. jj2
But seriously this is embarrassing. Madonna fans scalping each other in a thread that is supposed to drag Monsters.

Tragic. Stop this now and take it to chat or smth.


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3 minutes ago, Salvatore said:

Opinion invalidated. jj2
But seriously this is embarrassing. Madonna fans scalping each other in a thread that is supposed to drag Monsters.

Tragic. Stop this now and take it to chat or smth.
 

Well I agree, I tried many times to bring it back to my original point (which was pro-Madge and anti-Gaga ironically) but nobody's listening to me cry5

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2 minutes ago, Earth Ripper said:

What?! cry3

Of course I can't listen to it without thinking of her earlier catalogue, you're not able to do that physically if you actually listened to her earlier work. But I did say (multiple times now) that I believe that if I had that ability, I still wouldn't be impressed..

I literally just wrote this:

"So I'm both judging RH for being mediocre on its own ànd for being mediocre when compared to Madonna's catalogue and I already told you I'm doing both way earlier so omg why isn't this convo developing"

Cackle.

Then why didn't I like 1000 Forms of Fear without knowing Sia's earlier music? Then why didn't I like 21 without knowing Adele's earlier record? Then why didn't I like Rihanna's debut only knowing her first single? dead4 Because I thought the music was basic and people were overrating it. So that would be an exact parallel with what I think would happen if I heard RH as a debut album (and omg if you seriously believe that anyone would've been interested in that album as a debut, I seriously think you're mental) julia1

But you're the one who keeps telling me that I wouldn't be saying shit if someone else released RH as a debut album bey5 Then who the fuck am I supposed to imagine releasing it? You're the one insisting that I shouldn't judge the album based on Madonna's track record, then how the fuck am I supposed to judge the album?

I chose Ariana to compare Unapologetic Bitch to because it actually has some minor musical resemblances to Side to Side chi1 To me it's obvious that if I imagine Ariana recording both tracks, Side to Side would instantly shine as the superior track. How else am I supposed to balance out my supposedly biased take on RH as a Madonna album? You're making no sense.

 

I'm making no sense and yet you have this dedicated hatred towards fucking pop album lmfao1 when will monsters lmfao1 

at least i am able to separate two albums, i won't be shitting my pants with hatred because of that one that is not masterpiece and on pair with my favorite one lmfao1

 

I already explained PLENTY of times how this started, why this started and why i quoted you in the first place. You can twist things all you want now, save your fan fiction to yourself because it had nothing to do with why this started in the first place and i couldn't care less about it.

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Jjang said:

But that's not the same case omg do you legit think I can be tricked that easily? eve1

You can assume that these artists never won a Grammy due to racism on Grammy's side, sure, although I personally think Grammys awards are meaningless and the Academy has no taste to begin with - does this pattern apply to Madonna's case? nope. ew1 This is how Madonna's case applies on the scenario you created :

(1) 'X' black artist has been sweeping Grammys left and right ever since the beginning of his/her career.

(2) 'X' black artist suddenly stopped winning the last few years.

(3) 'X' black artist's fans claim it's because of racism. 

Now, does that sound like a convincing argument or rather lazy one to you? be honest. demi1

I didn't say they were the same argument. I mentioned it because Ageism and Racism are both issues in the music industry and outside of it, and both are QUESTIONED just like u are questioning ageism being done to Madonna. My point was just because someone questions it doesn't change the facts. Show me receipts of multiple women  that are Madonna's CURRENT age that have chart success and radio airplay?

 

I don't know why you keep going back to reviews, the issue of ageism is mostly focused on radio and sales. So the critics are Madge stans that hate Riri? It doesn't change the fact that radio is ageist and the consumers are ageist. 

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27 minutes ago, Li'l Sebastian said:

What chart worldwide? MEDIATRAFFIC? you do realize that singles chart is pointless there since it's not about sales? lmfao1 

Living for love just like the rest of those songs debuted high on DIGITAL sales charts, and charts today are not about SALES like they were 10 years ago when she debuted high and fell like a rock.

 

So if she is only banned on one radio station in UK show me receipts of her not being banned in the rest of the world? Why wasn't she able to enter top 70 on airplay chart if it was only one radio station? Why wasn't she able to enter top 100 radio chart in US? Top 50 on POP? Isn't she queen of pop?

I mean if there is no such thing as radio ban these days for older acts why wasn't she played like she was 10 years ago when music industry was different. I mean according to you people don't have problem with her age and her music is acclaimed by critics just like it was 10 years ago.

You should be the one showing receipts of her being banned worldwide, not the other way around. You're literally the same person who posted about Like a Prayer is overtaking Perfect Illusion on UK Airplay. 

And I want to point out : BBC Radio 1 didn't entirely ban Living For Live, they moved it to BBC Radio 2 - where it still failed.

If you actually studied your Madonna lesson like you claim you did, you'd learn that Pop Radio was actually trying to push Living For Love while it kept dropping on iTunes, she promoted it on several big award shows / talk shows and it still tanked. Why are you denying reality?

Why did Hung Up sell 2 million copies in the United States despite being blocked on the radio? a n s w e r. t h e. m o t h e r f u c k i n g. q u e s t i o n.

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5 minutes ago, Li'l Sebastian said:

I'm making no sense and yet you have this dedicated hatred towards fucking pop album lmfao1 when will monsters lmfao1 

at least i am able to separate two albums, i won't be shitting my pants with hatred because of that one that is not masterpiece and on pair with my favorite one lmfao1

I already explained PLENTY of times how this started, why this started and why i quoted you in the first place. You can twist things all you want now, save your fan fiction to yourself because it had nothing to do with why this started in the first place and i couldn't care less about it.

I'm not dedicated, I just mentioned my dislike for that album in passing to justify a comment about Gaga cry3 The only reason I'm still talking about that album is because @H.O.N.E.Y and you started to focus on one sentence in a huge post that was only 5% about RH because I said it was a weaker album than ARTPOP to me chi1 I tried to explain why I thought so and responded to the arguments you brought and then this unnecessary mess happened because you thought I was a lying fake fan who made up excuses for not liking that album, as if that was more important than what I was originally saying dead4

If anyone is dedicated to hating an album it's you hating ARTPOP in this thread and I've already questioned why you insult me for how I express my dislike for RH while you get to do everything I do x10 for an album you hate jj2 The best you could come back with was: "well you can hear my opinion, the truth, with your own ears" after quoting me over and over again about how I shouldn't present my opinion as a fact katy2 For someone that hates Gaga, you sure are familiarly contradicting and hypocritical.

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Just now, Jjang said:

You should be the one showing receipts of her being banned worldwide, not the other way around. You're literally the same person who posted about how Like a Prayer is overtaking Perfect Illusion on UK Airplay. 

If you actually studied your Madonna lesson like you claim you did, you'd learn that Pop Radio was actually trying to push Living For Love while it kept dropping on iTunes, she promoted it on several big award shows / talk shows and it still tanked. Why are you denying reality?

Why did Hung Up sell 2 million copies in the United States despite being blocked on the radio? a n s w e r. t h e. m o t h e r f u c k i n g. q u e s t i o n.

Nice try twisting this. Where are receipts of her not being banned on radios now? Where are they? You're the one claiming that nothing has changed in the last 10 years and we have same rules so p o s t m o t h e r f u c k i n g r e c e i p t s

You're the one saying that people don't have problem with her age and that her music is acclaimed? SO WHAT HAPPENED? ANSWER THE FUCKING QUESTION.

Isn't she queen of pop? Weren't;t her singles acclaimed? Why weren't they played at ALL on POP radios? Why? lmfao1

 

So now promo on tv equals in radio plays? Stop shitting already lmfao1 Song had 10m audio impressions in US or something like that, show me song that is slaying the charts with radio support like that?

 

Hung up didn't sell 2m, it sold 1,2m and what does that has to do do with anything? lmfao1not you actually comparing sales now from different time lmfao1 new low

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Earth Ripper said:

I'm not dedicated, I just mentioned my dislike for that album in passing to justify a comment about Gaga cry3 The only reason I'm still talking about that album is because @H.O.N.E.Y and you started to focus on one sentence in a huge post that was only 5% about RH because I said it was a weaker album than ARTPOP to me chi1 I tried to explain why I thought so and responded to the arguments you brought and then this unnecessary mess happened because you thought I was a lying fake fan who made up excuses for not liking that album, as if that was more important than what I was originally saying dead4

If anyone is dedicated to hating an album it's you hating ARTPOP in this thread and I've already questioned why you insult me for how I express my dislike for RH while you get to do everything I do x10 for an album you hate jj2 The best you could come back with was: "well you can hear my opinion, the truth, with your own ears" after quoting me over and over again about how I shouldn't present my opinion as a fact katy2 For someone that hates Gaga, you sure are familiarly contradicting and hypocritical.

Oh really if i'm so obsessed with hating Art Pop how come i played it this much?

http://www.last.fm/user/nebojsa92/library/music/Lady+Gaga/ARTPOP

 

I mean i already knew that you were one of those 'i hate 10s madonna and that makes me better than you' but this is seriously um3

 

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I mean Ayo is better than anything Madonna ever did since Hung Up so don't feel sorry for us. 

I mean if we're picking only one song as receipts than Ghosttown alone is better than gaga's existence because i say so   see, it works both ways  

I hate it when people be making these threads like they know what we want     and act like we are forcing ourselves to like the music. Why can't we just enjoy it without it being considered


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