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SeekingThrill

Madame X era - appreciation thread

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1 minute ago, Jjang said:

Kevin : EROTTEN!!! Because no melodies!!

Also Kevin : omg holy water is her best song

 

Just admit that you have a basic white girl bitch taste and move on sis no need to keep up the "im a member with valid opinions" facade that cracked since like 2016 

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This album really is one of her worst. i really don't get people try to see something good in it and say it's one of the best things she has ever done.

My first listen was an experience... of terror.

I have tried it two times after but no. it doesn't deserve to be in her discography in my opinion

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8 minutes ago, Desnudate said:

This album really is one of her worst. i really don't get people try to see something good in it and say it's one of the best things she has ever done.

My first listen was an experience... of terror.

I have tried it two times after but no. it doesn't deserve to be in her discography in my opinion

The taste jumped OUT!

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48 minutes ago, Jjang said:

Just admit that you have a basic white girl bitch taste and move on sis no need to keep up the "im a member with valid opinions" facade that cracked since like 2016 

XxZHQYN.gif

 

If that's what you like to refer to as my taste then I am more than happy to say so.

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I value different aspects in music. I don't like half-assed efforts that are presented as some sort of pretentious avent-garde #notforeverybody #acquiredtaste stuff. I value music that is PLEASANT to the ear. A nice interplay between vocals, catchy melodies and interesting instrumentals. There are bits and pieces of that in Madame X but as a whole it just doesn't serve that, IN MY OPINION.

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Holy Water never claimed to be anything but a slut bop and it does that and just THAT excellently well.

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oh and yes Erotten fits that criteria as well.

Some sort of wannabe piece of modern art but underneath the cover it's just faceless with no depth or substance.

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Also those dated-ass and trashy instrumentals, chile.

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5 minutes ago, Madonna said:

. A nice interplay between vocals, catchy melodies and interesting instrumentals

 

Except that's all over Madame X and you literally can't take that away from it. lj1 Maybe the "catchy melodies" part is less evident but jeez, if you think that that is an essential part of a body of work then its no mystery you like microwaved Pop ala Rebel Heart (and even here the catchy part is not evident but I'm rolling with you buddy.)

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5 minutes ago, Madonna said:

I value different aspects in music. I don't like half-assed efforts that are presented as some sort of pretentious avent-garde #notforeverybody #acquiredtaste stuff. I value music that is PLEASANT to the ear. A nice interplay between vocals, catchy melodies and interesting instrumentals. There are bits and pieces of that in Madame X but as a whole it just doesn't serve that, IN MY OPINION.

When you just admitted you only like easy-on-the-ear vocals and catchy melodies, no wonder chi1 So then just accept Madame X and Erotica are too "different" and not pop enough, the end, omg no need to slander her as "half-baked" or whatever. If you really think a song like Extreme Occident is half-baked garbage compared to something like Hold Tight then... Madonna is not for you lol.

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13 minutes ago, Jjang said:

Except that's all over Madame X and you literally can't take that away from it. lj1 Maybe the "catchy melodies" part is less evident but jeez, if you think that that is an essential part of a body of work then its no mystery you like microwaved Pop ala Rebel Heart (and even here the catchy part is not evident but I'm rolling with you buddy.)

dead2 If you say, so.

I don't see it. I get distracted by the nasal and vocoded vocals, the lack of cohesiveness, the lack of witty song writing...

I'm glad you seem to GRASP what I'm going for. Yes, it is an essential part of a body of work FOR ME. If that means I have basic taste, then I guess I do. I can't get into stuff like Björk or people of that vernacular. I don't listen to Madonna expecting some type of deconstructuralist, picasso type of music. I always felt she was able to keep a nice balance between contemporary music and some kind of depth or philosophical lyrics.

 

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5 minutes ago, Madonna said:

Yes, it is an essential part of a body of work FOR ME. If that means I have basic taste, then I guess I do. I can't get into stuff like Björk or people of that vernacular. I don't listen to Madonna expecting some type of deconstructuralist, picasso type of music.

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4 minutes ago, Earth Ripper said:

When you just admitted you only like easy-on-the-ear vocals and catchy melodies, no wonder chi1 So then just accept Madame X and Erotica are too "different" and not pop enough, the end, omg no need to slander her as "half-baked" or whatever. If you really think a song like Extreme Occident is half-baked garbage compared to something like Hold Tight then... Madonna is not for you lol.

Extreme Occident is actually in my top three from that album because I feel that that's a moment where she managed to keep a good balance. Also, I enjoy the album more the way I have arranged the tracklist. It does wonders for the listening experience. The same goes for Rebel Heart.

I would say:

Crazy
Extreme Occident
Future
Killers Who Are Partying
I Rise

are my top 5. Honoroble mentions to: Faz Gostoso and Bitch I'm Loca (which are both totally redundant slut bops but guilty pleasures). But yeah I really can't process songs like Dark Ballet, Ciao Bella (which barely has any Madonna in it) or IDSIF & God Control which sonically don't deserve a spot on this album.

Anyway, my tracklisting:

  1. Killers Who Are Partying
  2. Extreme Occident
  3. Dark Ballet
  4. Future
  5. Batuka
  6. Back That Up to the Beat (no idea why she revived the worst song from the Rebel Heart sessions)
  7. Bitch I'm Loca
  8. Faz Gostoso
  9. Medellín
  10. Funana
  11. Crazy
  12. Come Alive
  13. Crave
  14. I Rise
  15. Looking for Mercy
  16. Ciao Bella
  17. I Don't Search I Find
  18. God Control
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1 minute ago, Madonna said:

Extreme Occident is actually in my top three from that album

giphy.gif

1 minute ago, Madonna said:

But yeah I really can't process songs like Dark Ballet, Ciao Bella (which barely has any Madonna in it) or IDSIF & God Control which sonically don't deserve a spot on this album.

You forgot Batuka demi1

I get that, honestly. It took me a while to get into Dark Ballet even. But yeah ngl I do listen to a lot of "different" music and I don't give a shit about something being catchy or easy-on-the-ear so it's easier for me to get into this album than others. I just don't get how you can't hear that the instrumentals on this album are like a trillion times more attentively constructed with a gazillion more interesting details and textures than her last three albums jj4

I get that albums like MX and Erotica aren't very accessible for easy listening but I hate when people quickly jump to the conclusion that those albums must be bad then katy9 People who only watch Marvel shitting on art films teas oprah2

6 minutes ago, Madonna said:

Anyway, my tracklisting:

  1. Killers Who Are Partying
  2. Extreme Occident
  3. Dark Ballet
  4. Future
  5. Batuka
  6. Back That Up to the Beat (no idea why she revived the worst song from the Rebel Heart sessions)
  7. Bitch I'm Loca
  8. Faz Gostoso
  9. Medellín
  10. Funana
  11. Crazy
  12. Come Alive
  13. Crave
  14. I Rise
  15. Looking for Mercy
  16. Ciao Bella
  17. I Don't Search I Find
  18. God Control

I like what you did, honestly orangu1 I'd just cut out the songs that don't fit (BTUTTB, BIL, Medellin, Funana) but it's not a bad idea. I love the tracklist but I can't deny that first half is a little odd, especially the Medellin-Dark Ballet and Killers-Crave-Crazy and BIL-I Don't Search transitions. I peronally don't mind as much because I think flipping from one "state of mind" to the other is part of the album's message but I get how someone valuing easy listening music might find that distracting and, as a result, off-putting oprah11

But then I don't get how you can enjoy albums like LAP, ROL, Music and AL where she literally does the same thing orly1 She's never really been a "let's make an album that flows nicely" kinda gal.

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6 minutes ago, Madonna said:

dead2 If you say, so.

I don't see it. I get distracted by the nasal and vocoded vocals, the lack of cohesiveness, the lack of witty song writing...

I'm glad you seem to GRASP what I'm going for. Yes, it is an essential part of a body of work FOR ME. If that means I have basic taste, then I guess I do. I can't get into stuff like Björk or people of that vernacular. I don't listen to Madonna expecting some type of deconstructuralist, picasso type of music. I always felt she was album to keep a nice balance between contemporary music and some kind of depth or philosophical lyrics.

 

Then just say that you don't enjoy it, don't lie about its merit. It took me like 5 years to get into my favorite albums ever, incl. ones ironically by the artist you just named. Not everything has to be microwaved and ready to be pandered to the masses, sometimes music (and any form of art, really) hits in different ways and I'm actually sad you don't get to experience that. I mean, in my culture, we have 2 hour long songs that only have 3 verses, zero 'catchiness', yet are worshiped by multiple generations, so who's to say that that the standard structures and soundscapes we're used to listen to in Western culture is right or superior as opposed to just being an option? An option that is completely neglected in terms of musical superiority of course. 

 

No philosophical depth to the lyrics? oprah6

 

'We know, but we are just not ready to act
The storm isn't in the air, it's inside of us
I want to tell you about love and loneliness
But it's getting late now
Can't you hear outside of your Supreme hoodie, the wind that's beginning to howl?' 

 

'When they talk reforms, it makes me laugh
They pretend to help, it makes me laugh
I think I understand why people get a gun
I think I understand why we all give up
They say that we need love
But we need more than this'

 

'Just free your mind 
Welcome to the future, it's a culture ride 
Too much pain inside, It's an override
You've been puttin' too much time tryin' to survive
Don't like the person in your past, so you let 'em die'

 

'There's a storm ahead 
I hear the wind blowing 
Let me catch my breath 
Will we win this race?
Swear the road is long 
And the highway listens 
'cause it's a long way
'cause it's a long day '

 

'I know what I am (God knows what I am)
And I know what I'm not (And He knows what I'm not)
Do you know who you are?
Will we know when to stop?'


;Wild is the world
And lonely is the path
To come to you'

 

'Ran so far to try to find the thing I lacked and there it was
Inside of me
Ran and ran and ran so fast, a thing to last, and there it was
I hear you breathe '

 

'I put you on a pedestal, but statues, they can fall
Felt so safe, I let you drive me straight into the war 
Paid the hell you dealt me, thought you felt me
Was never good at games, now I'll just forget your name '

 

'I can't react how you thought I'd react, I would never for you
Front line, I won't stand in the back 'cause you want me to'

 

'I went to the far right
Then I went to the far left
I've tried to recover
My center of gravity
I guess I'm lost
I had to pay the cost
The thing that hurt me most
Was that I wasn't lost

No, I wasn't lost
It was a different feeling
A mix of lucidity, and craziness
But I wasn't lost, you believed me'

 

'It's our gypsy blood
We live between life and death
Waiting to move on
And in the end
We accept it
We shake hands with our fate
And we walk past
There's no rest for us in this world
Finally enough love'

 

'Is it really faith if I'm weak?
Can you tell the truth when you live lies?
I'm just looking for the signs
Hold my hand, please sympathize
Hard enough tryna forgive
Hard 'nough tryna live
Flawed, flawed by design, 
Please, please sympathize'

 

 

Like... how can you cringe at this and yet bop to I can't, icon, two letters apart, cause you're a stinging butterfly baby or whatever ... I mean, these are all very specific topics, clearly personally meaning a lot to her, with Rebel Heart its like ok lets make a Katy Perry empowering love song (L4L) then a post apocalyptic love song (Ghosttown) then my party song (BIM) then pandering to the wannabe deep druggies song (Devil Pray) and then we will rile a up a few internet nerds with googling Illuminati facts and rapping them like a market check list, and then im gonna do my grandma is sexual in the name of God trick again for the millionth time song (Holy Water) , then im gonna release a Eurovision production singing about hugging trees and holding hands (Hold Tight) then im gonna have my bad bitch moment (unapologetic bitch) then im gonna have my soccer mom crocodile tears fame is so hard song (Joane of Arc) and then I'm gonna give the public what they most want : the song equivalent of a Disney biopic in Rebel Heart ...

 

 

like... can't you see how vague and stereotypical all these emotions are in comparison to what is happening in MX? There's nothing specific, no cohesion whatsoever. Just a compilation of "Madonna is trying to revive her career using the oldest cards in the book" attempts. With MX, although yes it had a few of those kinda songs (with far better production however) she was finally making an album statement again and that's what Madonna is all about. 

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16 minutes ago, Jjang said:

Then just say that you don't enjoy it, don't lie about its merit. It took me like 5 years to get into my favorite albums ever, incl. ones ironically by the artist you just named. Not everything has to be microwaved and ready to be pandered to the masses, sometimes music (and any form of art, really) hits in different ways and I'm actually sad you don't get to experience that. I mean, in my culture, we have 2 hour long songs that only have 3 verses, zero 'catchiness', yet are worshiped by multiple generations, so who's to say that that the standard structures and soundscapes we're used to listen to in Western culture is right or superior as opposed to just being an option? An option that is completely neglected in terms of musical superiority of course. 

 

No philosophical depth to the lyrics? oprah6

 

'We know, but we are just not ready to act
The storm isn't in the air, it's inside of us
I want to tell you about love and loneliness
But it's getting late now
Can't you hear outside of your Supreme hoodie, the wind that's beginning to howl?' 

 

'When they talk reforms, it makes me laugh
They pretend to help, it makes me laugh
I think I understand why people get a gun
I think I understand why we all give up
They say that we need love
But we need more than this'

 

'Just free your mind 
Welcome to the future, it's a culture ride 
Too much pain inside, It's an override
You've been puttin' too much time tryin' to survive
Don't like the person in your past, so you let 'em die'

 

'There's a storm ahead 
I hear the wind blowing 
Let me catch my breath 
Will we win this race?
Swear the road is long 
And the highway listens 
'cause it's a long way
'cause it's a long day '

 

'I know what I am (God knows what I am)
And I know what I'm not (And He knows what I'm not)
Do you know who you are?
Will we know when to stop?'


;Wild is the world
And lonely is the path
To come to you'

 

'Ran so far to try to find the thing I lacked and there it was
Inside of me
Ran and ran and ran so fast, a thing to last, and there it was
I hear you breathe '

 

'I put you on a pedestal, but statues, they can fall
Felt so safe, I let you drive me straight into the war 
Paid the hell you dealt me, thought you felt me
Was never good at games, now I'll just forget your name '

 

'I can't react how you thought I'd react, I would never for you
Front line, I won't stand in the back 'cause you want me to'

 

'I went to the far right
Then I went to the far left
I've tried to recover
My center of gravity
I guess I'm lost
I had to pay the cost
The thing that hurt me most
Was that I wasn't lost

No, I wasn't lost
It was a different feeling
A mix of lucidity, and craziness
But I wasn't lost, you believed me'

 

'It's our gypsy blood
We live between life and death
Waiting to move on
And in the end
We accept it
We shake hands with our fate
And we walk past
There's no rest for us in this world
Finally enough love'

 

'Is it really faith if I'm weak?
Can you tell the truth when you live lies?
I'm just looking for the signs
Hold my hand, please sympathize
Hard enough tryna forgive
Hard 'nough tryna live
Flawed, flawed by design, 
Please, please sympathize'

 

 

Like... how can you cringe at this and yet bop to I can't, icon, two letters apart, cause you're a stinging butterfly baby or whatever ... I mean, these are all very specific topics, clearly personally meaning a lot to her, with Rebel Heart its like ok lets make a Katy Perry empowering love song (L4L) then a post apocalyptic love song (Ghosttown) then my party song (BIM) then pandering to the wannabe deep druggies song (Devil Pray) and then we will rile a up a few internet nerds with googling Illuminati facts and rapping them like a market check list, and then im gonna do my grandma is sexual in the name of God trick again for the millionth time song (Holy Water) , then im gonna release a Eurovision production singing about hugging trees and holding hands (Hold Tight) then im gonna have my bad bitch moment (unapologetic bitch) then im gonna have my soccer mom crocodile tears fame is so hard song (Joane of Arc) and then I'm gonna give the public what they most want : the song equivalent of a Disney biopic in Rebel Heart ...

 

 

like... can't you see how vague and stereotypical all these emotions are in comparison to what is happening in MX? There's nothing specific, no cohesion whatsoever. Just a compilation of "Madonna is trying to revive her career using the oldest cards in the book" attempts. With MX, although yes it had a few of those kinda songs (with far better production however) she was finally making an album statement again and that's what Madonna is all about. 

We‘re really running in circles here.

I don’t think there‘s any merit in music that is not pleasant to the ear. I understand music as something that is to be enjoyed, something that evokes emotion through lyrics and melodies. 
Others, you included have a very different definition of music.

There’s just no point in arguing about this. Human reception is entirely subjective. You will never understand how my ear and brain works and vice versa. So yeah, I won’t understand why you hate things that I like and you won’t understand me.

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3 minutes ago, Madonna said:

I don’t think there‘s any merit in music that is not pleasant to the ear. I understand music as something that is to be enjoyed, something that evokes emotion through lyrics and melodies.

Emotion can be evoked through other means than a catchy tune though... right? jj4

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3 hours ago, Jjang said:

Kevin : EROTTEN!!! Because no melodies!!

Also Kevin : omg holy water is her best song

 

Just admit that you have a basic white girl bitch taste and move on sis no need to keep up the "im a member with valid opinions" facade that cracked since like 2016 

XxZHQYN.gif

 

omg fall8

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The only song on this album that makes me scratch my head in confusion is Killers Who Are Partying. I just...don't get it. Especially with the "I'll be a woman if she's raped and her heart is tainted" or something like that. Ma'am, you are a woman. Also, you can't be Islam, that's a religion! You can be a Muslim though.

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Honestly, I love Madame X mostly because it's the first time I feel like Madge is finally interested in making music instead of just putting together songs for an album, ala MDNA / Rebel Heart. Sure, as someone said in here, the album does feel half baked and it has its flaws, but ultimately, it's part of its charm. I feel like this "flawed" nature (I guess?) of the record might as well be intentional because it for sure helps the lyrics & the message rise to the top and not get overshadowed by the production. Certain aspects of the album may come across as pretentious, I can see that, though it's not hard to compare this with MDNA and Rebel Heart and hear & see that it's for sure a more genuine and far more personal album. 

Also, Faz Gostoso is a masterpiece!

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@Earth Ripper  @Jjang

From technical point of view the production on Madame X is well executed. We all should agree with that.

However, I don't get why you don't criticize some stuff.

I Rise is a well made song, but it is basic. Sonically it is very close to stuff like Ghosttown and Queen. 

Faz Gostoso and Bitch I'm Loca are generic music. There are great stuff inspired by Latino culture on the album, then there are those two songs that are just a copy of popular commercial music from Latino scene. They are so out of place.

Looking For Mercy sounds like RH outtake. Dated.

Funana is a mess lyrically and musically. The same goes for Back That Up.

Come Alive is Body Shop part 2. 

 

We can say the deluxe songs are just bonus stuff that don't represent album's quality and leave it at that.

I would remove FG and BIL from the standard edition. EO deserved a place on the standard edition. 

 

Madame X is her best since COADF, but Madonna still likes to add some silly stuff that ruins the album. She is one of those artists who shouldn't have bonus songs on her albums. RH is the best example, where she threw everything on the album like @Jjang described. 

 

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